HTTYD 3 Rant

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Yes all of this

*raises hands in praise* You just said everything I've had at the tip of my tongue in perfect detail. Thank you so much for saying this haha

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Of course I care enough to read this whole thing! What I meant by "I don't care" is that I don't care that you like the movie, ie that you disagree. And I have to say, all that you said was very interesting! I admit my brain was a bit muddled by strong emotions in the process of writing this rant, so I may have reached for straws and/or over exaggerated some areas. I'm on mobile at the moment so I'll respond to your points as soon as I can get on a computer. But I'm glad you responded because it's always nice to hear a different point of view. 

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I have strong personal disagreements with a lot of this but as they are opinion based I'm not going to bring them up.

 

The cat one though. Toothless shows an encredible ability to pick up meanings of actions of other beings and to re-create faceal expressions. He's encredibly social and bonded to people. In gift of the nightfury he also throws away his first auto-tail in favor of continueing to fly with Hiccup. The sheer level of bond with Hiccup contradicts the idea that this is a solitary species. He might move like a cat but nothing else about him suggests solitary. In the show he doesn't try to take time for himself....ever. He's ALWAYS by Hiccup or breaking away to investigate something before coming right back. Solitary animals are introverted my nature. They should have moments where they just don't want to be near someone for a little while. While I doubt nightfurys hunt in packs because they just don't need to they must have some social needs in the wild.

I'm not saying that it's impossible for a solitary animal to form bonds or anything but the sheer level of bonded is much more like a dog (pack animal) then a solitary cat like a tiger. 

 

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Wow, that's a really good point. I never noticed that.

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Wassup

All right. I’m going to respond to your points in chronological order and by paragraph. Honestly, I appreciate the time you took to write out that response. I’m also glad you liked the movie! 

 

“If you like it, I honestly don’t care” just means I’m okay with you disagreeing with me. And yeah, the storytelling bit was a bit unnecessary now that you point it out. I wanted to write a rant, albeit an incomplete one, because I did not want to forget anything. The stuff I covered in the rant was the stuff that bugged me the most. And yes! I would like to see why you like it.

 

You’ve got a point by the videos. The only reasons I go to them is to understand the story better (which makes my storytelling abilities VERY questionable, LOL) so that I can try and figure out why I didn’t like it, and of course to find some common ground with people. But it’s mostly the former. Because while I have an easier time figuring out what I do and don’t like in books, it’s much harder for me to do that with movies. And I don’t know anyone who likes writing and reading as much as I do to where they could explain it to me.

 

Well, that’s a relief that Snotlout isn’t hitting on Valka. But the way the movie portrays their interactions just makes it seem that way, and I was immensely grossed out by it. But maybe that’s just me.

 

As for Tuffnut, the reason I didn’t go into detail is because of the stuff he says. I don’t want to say it on here. I mean, I can appreciate an adult joke, but it’s just my preference that I don’t want them in this particular franchise, so my point about that is illogical and something that I know I have to deal with.

 

You have some very good points about the deathgrippers. And when you point out other instances, it starts to make sense to me too.

 

The theme, though, was my problem. I get what you’re saying, I really do, but a “love of the hunt,” really? That’s his motivation? And, in at least the second movie and RTTE, wasn’t the theme about being stronger together? As Hiccup says to Toothless in 2, “as one.” That’s what Gift of the Night Fury was building up to. Toothless gave up his ability to fly independently because flying was basically bonding time with Hiccup. Toothless wrecked the auto tail in GOTNF, but in Hidden World he’s so willing to take it back all for some girl? That he met two seconds ago? And if NF’s and LF’s supposedly mate for life, then wouldn’t the LF spend a bit more time to see how Toothless could win her over? I just can’t get on board for that.

 

When I say Toothless is based off of cats, I mean that term loosely, but in my rant I compared them to feral cats rather than big cats behaviorally. Again, I used that term loosely. Because panthers and tigers are still cats. And the way you explain the NF’s eventual extinction makes sense, but it’d still be hard to assume how quickly they d.ie out because we still don’t know the exact environment that they lived in or how many there even were. Plus, since Grimmel probably traveled from island to island by ship, and since there wasn’t any guarantee that the NF living on an island would be there by the time he got there, it’d probably still take a very long time to get rid of them completely. And if the vikings helped with their extinction, it wouldn’t be by very much, because, like I said, this was all before the confirmation of things like Dragon Root arrows and dragon-proof material. Not to mention any of the other kinds of tech we see in the shows.

 

I like how you explained this. It makes sense. I still think it’s possible that there could’ve been multiple at one point because the timing between Toothless’ shots in the first movie makes it pretty evident that it’s just him.

 

The split spines don’t bother me, obviously. I just don’t understand why the alpha mode was necessary for a dragon that, without alpha mode, could knock over a Red D.eath with just one of its shots. As for the lightning invisibility thing, it’s like with the alpha mode. NF’s are nocturnal. And they’re black. Why does a dragon that is already hard to spot in the dark and only comes out at night need to be able to turn completely invisible? That aspect was just used as a plot device when the d.eathgrippers overpowered Toothless.

 

Honestly, my prejudice against the LF’s comes not only because of the LF and her as a character, but also because the LF as a species was used as a replacement. Literally. You could’ve swapped out LF’s for NF’s and the plot wouldn’t change at all. I went back to the Wiki for the LF’s stats, and they’re literally the exact same as a NF’s. Even the armor. Their armor. Sure we have diversity in appearance, but the LF is the exact same as an NF save for the blast, the nubs, the blue eyes, and the sparkly white scales. That’s why I’m okay with the woolly howl and sand wraith, because at least their stats and looks are vastly different. I’d be fine with the LF if there was more effort put into their differences. But, as Wiki put, “coincidentally, the two species (LF and NF) also share the exact same stats.” In my version there would be no LF because I’m not using the species as a replacement for a NF love interest. If I did introduce the LF as a species, it would be in a few episodes of a show since NF’s wouldn’t all be d.ead. They wouldn’t just be a NF with white sparkly scales and blue eyes. 

 

They’re b.utchered because they’re background noise. And personally, I just think that Snotlout and Tuffnut were acting weird. Like, I get that Snotlout is self-conscious and that Tuffnut is weird, but I feel like it was turned up to obnoxious levels. I don’t remember anything about the others except for Astrid in the wedding and Hidden World and Valka interacting with Snotlout. I don’t remember anything Ruff, Eret, Fishlegs, or even Valka says. I can’t even remember Fishlegs in the movie. That’s why I loved Race to the Edge. It really highlights the gang’s friendship and their personalities and it doesn’t feel like the only ones being focused on are Hiccup and Toothless. And I get that this is Toothless’ story, but they’re his friends too. Not just Hiccup’s.

 

In this next paragraph, I think you’re just making a general statement or responding to someone else, so I don’t have anything to say. 

 

The fanservice is, again, a preference. But I legit cringed when the vikings were like “take him down, Hiccup” because that moment didn’t feel earned. And it wasn’t, either. There was no big villain buildup, which is fine. But the HTTYD franchise and even the new Star Wars trilogy seemed to want to have this Endgame-like moment. Like, no, you didn’t spend 10 years and 20+ films building up to an epic villain. Grimmel has a weak motivation and Palpatine d.ied on the second D.eath Star.

 

Again, I can’t say much about animation. It looks great, but at some moments it looks cartoony (especially with Toothless). I just simply don’t have an eye for those kinds of things.

 

I always viewed this trilogy as Toothless’ and Hiccup’s story. It’s about their forbidden friendship. Hiccup developed in all three movies, just in different ways. In the first, he learned that not all dragons are bad. In the second, he stopped messing around and accepted his position as Chief in Stoick’s place. In the third, he learned that sometimes it is better to let go of the ones you love. Which, I think, is a beautiful message, and a bittersweet one, but the execution of it was poor. And the end of HTTYD 3 literally undermines the dragons’ going-away. Why in the world would you make the dragons leave—forever, if not for an extended period of time—if you’re just going to go back and visit them and . . . wait! Toothless visits Berk. What’s the point of him leaving if he’s just going to come back? What’s the point of any of the dragons leaving if they’re just going to come back and visit the Berkians? At this point, they should have just moved into the Hidden World with the dragons.

 

Trust me, even though I do not like this movie, I am very open-minded when it comes to at least hearing out the other side. And I’m glad you did explain some things because it helped.

 

Ouch, harsh much? Of course I care about your post! And I do understand why you have that view, so thank you for sharing! I’m honestly happy for anyone who finds enjoyment in this movie. I just wish I did because I’ve been such a fan for so long. You know?

 
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Very well, but that's perspective versus perspective, and something as vague as that statement came off pretty ignorant to me in particular... Then again, I was also in an... I guess argumentative mood last night, and that entire post took me about... 4 or more hours to actually make and perfect.... I do admit, emotions had also sprinkled into my post as well, so for me to chastise you for adding it into your rant seems pretty hypocritical of me. So, I won't. But I do think you should of just looked it over a little more and added or removed some things that didn't make much sense.. Or at least added a little more details, since you seem extremely passionate about the topic. But, think the thing that bothered me most about it was the storytelling bit.. Although I am curious about how your stories are, so if you did make a fanfic redoing HTTYD 3, I would gladly read it. I still liked the last movie a lot, but I do like reading other renditions of it. Even making my own, but that's for my evil Hiccup story I got going XD

 

Yeah I guess... I don't know, when I watched it the first time I never saw Snotlout's commentary like that, never thought anyone would think of it like that either until I heard it from both Cinemasins and Cinemawins. Then looked into other videos cause I wanted to know what others thought about the movie in general and they continued to bring that up. Just seemed weird to me, because in the first and second movie, you can easily see what his flirting looks like with both Astrid and Ruffnut. Which seems pretty different to me.... You can see him actually trying and just acting like a basic TV jock for those two, but idk, just seemed weird to me that people saw it that way :T

 

Love of the hunt and to finish what I'm assuming is a life goal for him... As shown in the end when he turns against the warlords and threatens Toothless' life. He wants the Night Fury species extinct. Seems like a pretty driving reason to me.

 

Yeah, but... As Astrid and Gobber point in the beginning of the movie "There's too many dragon's here" "Everyone seems to know we have dragons now", and since their main issue is Warlords... (Grimmel comes in later on request of the Warlords), they're going to be in constant war with these people. So.. If by sending the dragons away to have less conflict.. Isn't that better? By the looks of it, both Hiccup and Toothless wanted to bring the Light Fury into their world, it's her who wasn't up to adapt into their lives. So she brought Toothless to the Hidden World to keep her life the same, and who knows, maybe he would of came back if Hiccup and Astrid didn't go searching for him.

 

But... He wasn't traveling by ship in the movie, he had an contraption of flight with help from the Deathgrippers. Grimmel looks to be in his late adult hood, and is as innovative as Hiccup is, I'd like to think he's had that for many many years now. Having k.illed a Night Fury when he was young, I'm assuming around Hiccup's age, and declared from then on to eradicate all Night Furies to "bring true peace to the world". Probably figured out how to control a Deathgripper a few short years after and went from there. He's also a hunter... and a very good one at that.. You tend to learn animal trails, breeding spots, habitats, and more being a hunter. Especially if you're obessing over one particular species of dragon. I mean, Heather easily figured out the Flightmare's pattern in a short amount of time. I think, the Dragon Root arrows and such were only new to the Berkians, where as everyone outside of Hiccup's archipelago was already well accustomed to those. Dragon Root arrows could of also helped him in understanding how to control the Deathgrippers with their own venom.

 

Alteroi actually made an interesting video about Light Furies and Night Furies. Where it's actually the Night Fury that's a mutation from the Light Fury. Since Night Furies needed more heat to mirror their scales, they could of adapted to having darker coloured skin already to avoid needing to make a distracting blast, and then this allows them to just go in and attack with ease. Only needing to use the invisibility in extreme cases, maybe during the day if they needed, or it's just left over genetics from the Light fury. Which is an interesting spin on things :P

 

Yeah, I do admit that I wish there was at least some other Night Furies, causes again... Toothless is the last pure Night Fury left with Light Fury inclusion. Which is one of the biggest things I hate about this movie. So, I see your point there.

 

Fishlegs was in the movie, he was the one always carrying around the baby. But, yeah, you do need character relief in this particular story, and Snotlout and Tuff took up the majority of it. But I think their parts were actually less in the first and second movie. This movie actually shows how much they've all bonded together more than the other two did. First they were just getting use to Hiccup being in the group, second they actually spent apart, and encouraged the plot forward (mainly Astrid here). While the third they're shown hanging out, conversing more often, and showing how they work in battle together, so I don't think it's that b.utchered at all. Ruff actually pushed the plot forward most here when she preformed her "most annoying prisoner" act in Grimmel's hold. Which, I can start to see why he was even in the cell room with her, since the Crimson Goregutter kinda took out his tower.... So, maybe that's all he had left, or he was actually waiting for her to slip up and spill something of intellectual use.... Which she did, and he sent her off to follow. Then, Eret just spews off knowledge of his dragon trapping days for everyone to get an idea of how Grimmel is. And yeah... But, to be fair.... When they gave the twins entire episodes to themselves, it got a little much... (Bad moon rising) But, yes, I did like RTTE for that too. I don't like RTTE for what they did to Valka and Drago though....

 

Honestly, I completely forgot that line was from the second movie, and yeah you're right. That coming from Astrid in the second was built up properly. That coming from a random viking on the island where they only half know what's going on... Does seem pretty forced. If it came from, Astrid again, or one of the other five mains, then I'd understand. I haven't seen anything from Star Wars, honestly, only thing I know from that really.. and it's not even in Star Wars itself. Is Dean's desire to take the grow with the audience approach and put that in the HTTYD franchise. He apparently used a lot of Star Wars story writing concepts and connection with the audience for HTTYD. That's just about all I know about Star Wars... XD

 

Yeah... Don't think I liked Toothless' animation much in the last movie... Seemed too floppy, instead of how it was in the first movie, and the second seemed to be a nice blend between cartoon and realistic. Which is strange, because they didn't seem to make any other dragon's animation floppy or cartoony, not even the baby Gronckle Fishlegs carried around.

 

Because.. The dragon's aren't always on display for everyone to know about. A few dragons coming and going for a short duration of time, because I'm assuming it would only be for the last generation of dragon riders that would still have returning dragons. Now, I think the main reason they couldn't go to the Hidden World with the dragons is.. Well.. One, that's trying to convince several wild dragons to share a home that they've owned to themselves for millennia. Yes, Toothless is the Alpha, but the dragons are still their own individuals, they still have their own preference, so they'll be and were extremely hostile to the vikings. Second reason is.... Humans need sunlight every once in a while.... A human's needs differ from dragon's needs by a lot... And yes... Vikings can have up to a month of nothing but night (Midnight Sun), or a month of nothing but day... But, a few years without vitamin D and you're going to have extremely weak bones....
 

Maybe rewatching it with other views in mind now could help at least appreciate the movie XD but, again, I'm not here to change minds, just tell what I see.

 

And again.. Sorry for the harsh end.. XD But thank you for reading and continuing to read this :P

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It's all good. And wow that's a long time. I only spent an hour or two writing my rant. And earlier today I actually rewatched the movie to get my facts a little right in case my memory of it was muddled. I have to say, I don't like it any more than I did before, but I understand why the creators decided to go with that ending. However, I don't think it fit in the case of the movies. With the books, sure, but the movies were supposed to be an almost entirely separate entity, so them throwing in an ending that doesn't make any sense in this particular version of the HTTYD franchise is completely unnecessary and contradicts the themes and development of the first two movies.

 

Since I rewatched HTTYD 3 earlier, I can say that Snotlout definitely wasn't flirting with Valka. However, the way his self-conscious tendencies are over-exaggerated made it seem that he was. I get that he likes to sidle up with authoratative figures, but it was cranked up to such a degree that I couldn't stand it. In RTTE, at least, his insecurities are more subtle, and it actually takes Hiccup quite a while to figure that out. Even I didn't notice that until Hiccup pointed out to Stoick about Snotlout and Spitelout wanting to impress them. While Snotlout wanting to do the same to Valka makes sense, they should've toned it down like in the show. Literally all he ever talks about in the movie is getting Valka to like him and saying how he'll be chief if Hiccup d.ies. What kind of friend does that?

 

I can't remember who pointed it out, but someone commented on how Grimmel was essentially Hiccup's evil twin. He was his foil. If Hiccup had killed Toothless in the woods, he could've turned into someone like Grimmel (which I kind of doubt because that's not really his personality, but the possibility is still there). That aspect of Grimmel was something I very much appreciate, so I've kind of changed my mind on his "love of the hunt" mindset. But I still think it's very implausible that he could've killed every NF by himself. So if I were to rewrite the third movie, he would be in the process of making the species extinct, not almost finished. 

 

What's interesting to me is that, if this franchise supposedly takes place in the real world (which I think the creators said that), then humans have had a couple thousand years to be sharing a planet with dragons. And if indeed Hiccup and Valka were the very first people to ride dragons, then that means that in the span of 8 or so thousand years humans and dragons have been at war. I think it was 2 of the Warlords who looked Asian, so that either means they killed off the dragons that lived in their region of the world and are looking for more, or they're outliers in their cultures looking for a way to get rich (since some Asian cultures revered dragons). And I think that humans and dragons separating would be even worse. It's like a human and their dog. On its own, the human has built entire civilizations. On its own, the dog is a pack animal and comes in such a variety of breeds you could own 10 and use them all for different tasks. But when the human and dog work together, they can accomplish more. And when they accomplish more, they guarantee the survival of both the human and the dog. The dog can hunt animals the human cannot. The dog can herd animals, protect its human, or even provide services for humans with disabilities. Because the dog is such an ideal, well-rounded animal, the human ensures its survival because it's useful to them. Why don't the Vikings fight h.arder to keep their dragons? While dragons and dogs are not so different, the third movie has such a h.ard time deciding if it wants to treat them as just wild animals that just happen to be pets or like dogs. Well, since the third movie obviously chooses the former, does that mean that the dragons that were tamed struggle to survive on their own? Sure the HW dragons probably work together to survive, but someone's got to go to the surface to get fish for them to eat. Does this kind of make sense?

 

I totally forgot about his flying contraption, lol.

 

The NF being a subspecies of the LF is actually a very interesting theory. I still think that the lightning thing was just used as a plot device. Because when is a dark dragon that is nocturnal ever really going to need to go invisible? During the day time? If they're attacked? I think they can handle themselves quite well on their own if they're solitary, and even better if they form small clans.

 

Yeah, I hate that Toothless is the last NF. I so wish we got some closure with the species (well, good closure).

 

Agree and disagree. I wish we got to see them more, especially Valka and Eret. Well, especially Eret, because I absolutely love redemption arcs. Like, I know we saw them all just chatting . . . I don't know. I guess I wanted them to be more vital to the plot? Except for Ruff. I think they b.utchered her by making her even more stupid than she is, which goes back to their mischaracterization. Snotlout's, Ruff's, and Tuff's personalities were just over-exaggerated. I liked the subtelty in RTTE.

 

Yeah, I didn't like that fan-service. There was another line that I couldn't remember for the life of me and I finally remembered it when I watched the movie again. It was one from Hiccup when Hiccup was trying to figure out how to get Toothless and Berk's dragons back (which I cannot believe that Toothless was willing to order Berk's dragons into the cages of people who will k.ill them just for some girl he met the day beforeugh). Astrid asked Hiccup what he was going to do, and he said, "Probably something stupid." I cringed. 

 

Oh, well you're not missing out on much. The original trilogy is amazing, the prequel is pretty bad (those who like just like the worldbuilding and are nostalgic about it, lol), and the sequel can burn in a dumpster for all I care.

 

Yeah, Toothless especially looked too . . . soft? In the first, at least, he seemed slimmer, and his skin seemed to be t.ighter (dunno if that word will censor). I guess it's just the style they went with, because his pupils are much bigger than they were in even the second movie. I honetly prefer the slimmer ones like in the first movie, but it's a preference.

 

Yes, the dragons are individuals, but it kind of goes back to my paragraph about the movie treating them as wild animals in captivity rather than a domesticated animal. Domesticated animals can express their personality more because they aren't constantly worried about surviving (unless you're a cow or something, LOL), where wild animals are instinctual (Toothless immediately choosing the LF over his best friend because of h.ormones). Literally, the entirety of the first movie was about Toothless learning to trust a human. And about Hiccup convincing the Vikings that dragons are not just wild animals. They can be tamed. That's why Valka didn't come back to Berk. Because she didn't think they'd accept Cloudjumper. Then HTTYD 3 comes around and proves Valka's point after she developed to trust humans with dragons in the second movie. I mean, even in HTTYD 2, Hiccup at least tries to convince Drago that dragons are amazing creatures and whatnot. He gives him plenty of chances until Drago orders the Bewilderbeast to k.ill them all. Then, and only then, did Toothless go ballistic and go "alpha." Maybe if the Vikings couldn't really "live" in the HW, then they could live on an island near it to protect it from hunters who want to find it. Then the dragons visiting them would make a ton more sense.

 

Good gosh I need to rewrite this movie, or give my ideas to someone who will know what they're doing a lot better than me. I rewatched it earlier today and kept a notebook so that I could write down what was wrong with it, not what I wanted to be in it, and I filled almost three and a half pages, so maybe I'll post that. Again, it's no problem. We're all passionate and defensive of the franchise. I get it. Sometimes you're in a bad mood and decide to stay stuff a little harsher than you mean. Honestly, I had assumed that while I was reading it. And I appreciate you not insulting me personally. I've already had that happen to me on another platform. The person said I was too stupid to see the genius of the movie or something. Like, insulting me is not going to change my mind, lol. But it's all good. Trust me. Also, maybe if I get around to it, I'll write a fanfiction or at least a summary/script, but I tend to write original stories rather than fanfics. Right now I'm just so busy with school. DX

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Great job!

Although I disagree, I must say, AMAZING points. In fact, you might have changed my mind on some things. However, I can not condone the killing of the Deathgrippers. Toothless was controlled and ACTUALLY KILLED STOIC, but he was treated kindly, while the Deathgrippers only TRIED to kill them and were killed without ANY remorse WHATSOEVER! Otherwise, great job!

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Look at it this way... If a group of lions were seconds away from tearing you apart, and you had the ability to summon lightning... Are you telling me that your instincts wouldn't kick in and use this ability? And who's to say they died? The fall didn't look that far, and if the dragons had enough positive ions in their body, they would easily survive the blast. Perhaps were out for a while, but we never really saw the fate of those dragons. And they were indeed trying to kill them. And if I remember correctly, Grimmel stated these particular dragons were actually naturally dragon killers.

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Wow!

You have officially changed my mind. I still love Deathgrippers though.

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Okay, I see that a lot of

Okay, I see that a lot of people already covered the topic well, but hey, I can throw my opinion too

 

Plot:

It was... well bad

In a way it wasn’t connecting with the previous movies, not only through the gang and other weirdly changing but I also did not like the fact they just threw a new, completely unknown villain in - like what?

And even If we wpuld go with that, I would have given him a better motivation, maybe somehow connected to Drago, and not just make him a fury k.iller, since there’s no way he defeated them all alone.

 

Light Fury

Hmm... that’s tricky

I did not like her, honestly. She might look pretty, but the way she acts and her existence... I don’t know, I just don’t feel it

On the other hand, adding a female Night Fury would be a big cliche - but still a better option, even though my favorite choice would be just end the franchise in a different way:

Toothless does not find a mate and after defeating a new villain/changed one he and maybe some of other dragons make the choice to leave, Toothlesse’s motivation being the protection of other dragons as „the alpha” (if we leave that) and the desire to find a mate, that could not be fulfilled while staying with humans

 

Well yes, I don’t have much time right now to analyze everyting, but yes, those are the main negative points that I have to say about the third movie

 

Feel free to disagree and discuss with me 

 

 

 

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.

I believe it was after HTTYD 2 that the director confirmed Toothless was the last Night Fury. It was hinted at that there were other subspecies of Fury when Grimmel said, "Furies mate for life." This suggests he knew darn well that Night Furies were only one type of Fury. I actually appreciated that the Light Fury was introduced but I did NOT like her character. I mean I get why she doesn't trust humans (the poor thing was abused after capture), but her general personality was so bland and underdeveloped, and even as another Fury I can't understand why she would be a white Night Fury instead of real differences (the shorter nubs/ears and smoother head are obviously se.x characteristics that would probably be on a female Night Fury too). The only actual differences I can see are the fins on her tail which SLIGHTLY differ from Toothless', wings, eyes, and she doesn't have retractable teeth (I feel like I'm the only one who noticed this). While it's also a possibility that all of these could be se.x characteristics in the Fury family, I'm choosing to believe she ACTUALLY isn't just a blank Toothless.

 

One of my biggest gripes, far bigger than the LF, is...Toothless. Hiccup and friends have matured and grown but remained true to form. In the beginning, this goes for Toothless too. Now he IS a male so it's natural for him to chase a female and try to find a mate, but he completely abandons Hiccup. That is 100% out of character for him. For five years those two have had an unshatterable bond and in just a few days he leaves and clearly doesn't plan on returning. What. Just...what. And the hurt in Hiccup got to me when I saw that. 
 

Where did the LF really come from? This isn't about her in specific, but it's always been a question of mine. She clearly comes from the Hidden World or has at least discovered and lived in it, but she's either lived outside or ventured VERY LONG DISTANCES enough to know precisely how to get back. So what brought her back out of the Hidden World in the first place? It wasn't food, which is the primary reason animals leave their habitats, and it wasn't harsh conditions which is the runner up reason. There are other Light Furies in there so she wasn't searching for a mate before she met Toothless. If the hunters had found the Hidden World they would've taken a lot more dragons and moved away from Berk and closer to a dragon jackpot, but they still targeted Berk and never moved, so they didn't find the HW. Which means the LF wasn't capture there...she came out and flew far away from it, but WHY??? What compelled her to do that? I can seriously see nothing that would make her leave or even feel like she needed to. This has gnawed at me for quite some time now.

 

I won't even go into all the things wrong with the HW. Most people have covered it anyway. The list requires legal paper to complete.

 

Finally, this movie's action scenes were underwhelming. In the first movie we got a giant death dragon battle that cost our hero his leg. The second movie got EVEN BETTER with the Biwilderbeasts battling each other, armies forming on one island, an interesting villain, an explanation on Valka's disappearance, various new breeds of dragons were introduced, wild dragons working in tandem against the villain's armored dragons, an unexpected character death by an even more unexpected character, backstories, cutscenes, comedy relief, cute moments, new and original soundtracks! The sequel is rarely better than the first, but the movie clearly outdid itself. I was set up to expect another extraordinary movie wondering if this new action scene would be-- Wait. Our new villain literally has no reason to set out killing Night Furies other than one past event that most likely involved more than one species of dragon...? At least Draco set out for world peace through the worst methods (he thought his control would bring unity). And Grimmel here, he's a mindless killer that cares about only one single dragon species and can't move on with his life until Toothless is dead, knowing the Night Furies will hideout when Toothless gets old anyway. I like the movie overall, for its good points, but there are also more questions and gripes I have with HTTYD 3 than any of the others.

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Shiny the Night Fury plasma blasted my subject. Sorry!

I know it's been a while, but I wanted to say that I agree with everything you said!

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Lightning thought the subject was trying to attack me... RIP

*Bursts open the door, longbow drawn and aiming it at you while Lightning, my friend the night fury, prepares to blast* "HEY! You stole my thread idea!"

 

All jokes aside, you spoke my thoughts perfectly. When the first movie came out, I, too, was obsessed. Everything about Toothless was just so... amazing. He seemed better than the other dragons at first glace, for sure, but a closer look and he really wasn't. Just different, and in a way all of us can relate too. My brother and I spent HOURS looking at the dragon stats in the extra stuff, and he straight up memorized ALL of it! We would role play with our friends whenever they came over (I'm ashamed to admit it, but I kinda stole the night fury and let no one else play it cause they were supposed to be rare ;-;  I made up for it though! I designed them all their own custom dragons!), on my birthday I had a party and hid pictures and descriptions of all the dragons, giving everyone a cover and you tried to get the most pages in your Book of Dragons... I think I really crossed the line for obsessed. I even started writing a fanfiction (my first story ever, I sadly did not finish and looking back at it now I cringe sooo bad).

 

Then HTTYD 2 came out.
I'm going to be honest here. I tried to defend it. I didn't want it to be ruined like so many other stories have been. I lied to myself about what made sense. "Oh? Hiccup's mom decided to abandon her infant child and live with dragons, and she claims she couldn't even come back for him and bring him to this happier life because she thought he would be better off without her? PSHT, that's fine! She probobly... thought the dragons only liked her! Yeah, that's it! She didn't think they would accept another human!"

"He controls the bewilderbeast with a stick? Of COURSE the bewilderbeast can hear that little rattle across the entire battlefield! I'm sure he's very fammiliar with the noise; Draco Bludvist probobly used it as a toy for him when he was only a hatchling! I'm sure he has warm memories of his master and never dreams of wanting to squish him and simply take over because he loves him too much!"

"Yeah, I bet those dragons all look the same because they have a common anscestor. It's totally not lack of creativity so they shoved a bunch of dragon parts into a computer and randomly generated wart covered sticks and stones." (No personal offense, I know some people like these dragons, but I HATE them. They have zero effort. No, scratch that, they've got less than zero effort.)

Then HTTYD 3 came out.
Hey, everyone, you know what these movies are called, right? "How To Train Your Dragon"? Well, this last movie is completly contradictary to it's own title. It should be renamed "How to give up your dragon due to peer pressure and fear you won't be able to protect them from madmen who will hunt them no matter where they are, because you TOTALLY haven't been doing an amazing job for the last 6 years."

Oh wait, did I hear that correctly? 6 years? I thought it would have been ten...
NOPE
It takes ONE YEAR from Draco Bludvist being defeated for Grimmel to rise up. If you weren't a viking, Hiccup, I would be starting to see where your concerns are coming from.

And please... can we not even speak of Toothless's pathetic excuses for clones? Or of how his personallity has gone from a realistic and animal-like behavior to a whole new Ash and Pikachu scene? Or how he goes from being a slightly more powerful than average, majestic, cat-like creature, to the most garbage piece of OP power mashup, marketing toy, human-like monster who acts more and more like a child the older he gets?

 

 

I'm sorry Dreamworks, but I'm going to pretend none of the latter HTTYD movies exist. If I accepted them as part of the HTTYD franchise, I think I'd give up liking the whole thing and go puke in my room for a month.

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I have spoken the forbidden words

As much as it pains me to say this... I agree. With everything. I was a big fan when I was younger, I was even a fan of the third movie when it came out, but now... the third movie is terrible, the second movie is okay, and the first is the good one. I would much rather read the books then watch all of the characters suffer their demise(from a writing perspective). RTTE was great. I was hoping for the next movie to be like it. But it wasn't. I was like, fun moive yay! ... And then I looked deeper... and was not happy with what I found. Now, I shall leave you all to read my depressing rant while I go mope around some more. 

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.

Wow!! You summoned my thoughts up perfectly! The first is nearly perfection. The second one was all right for a sequel, but the third one is just absolute garbage. My overall interest in the series lessened with the second movie, but after the third . . . My gosh I could not bring myself to like it. My favorite dragon species became OP, Toothless becomes some lovesick puppy, and we get a replacement for the now extinct night fury. 

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What I hated was how

What I hated was how Toothless just left Hiccup for a dragon he just met especially one that's too wild like seriously she pushed Hiccup right off him what the-!? and don't get me started on Grimmel.

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.

Plus, instead of diving straight for Hiccup, Toothless' attention lingers on the LF who knocked him off. Like what?? That's some mischaracterization if I ever saw it. And then Toothless got mad when Hiccup went to the Hidden World to check on him. What the heck?? HTTYD 3 literally made me despise Toothless. I liked his personality in the first movie the best. 

Warmetalgarurumon
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same here his personality was

same here his personality was better between movie 1 to movie 2 but movie 3 messed it up

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Be prepared for a pretty long post

The first moment when I became a fan was when I heard the score "Forbidden Friendship."  As a piano player, I was dreaming what the notes could be like and wondered, "Could I play this song?"  Turns out, I did find it.  And for anyone interested, I have piano sheet music if you want to play it.  Though, forewarning, it is quite advanced music to try and play.  Also, here is a recording of me playing it: https://soundcloud.com/jack-miller-100/me-playing-sebastian-wolffs-piano-cover-of-forbidden-friendship-better-expression

 

I think seeing the 3rd movie in theathers is what brings most of the charm to the third movie.  Especially for someone like me who has graduated college with an Animation degree with hopes of one day working at DreamWorks as a modeler or animator.  Two things with this kind of mind stood out to me.  The water texturing and physics and the texturing on all the Dragon Armor.  It did not look to me like it was a flat plain with a texture map making it look 3D.  It really looked like all the dragon scales on the armor was fully modeled.  This would add hundreds of faces to each character, then add that over how many characters are in the same scene, then add any dragons, then add any of the buildings/environment, then add in post processing effects...  The amount of sheer processing power to just do Berk with the water in the background was extremely impressive.  To then be able to do all of this and then do it in the Hidden World, it is quite amazing how they were able to pull the whole movie off in the same amount of time it took them to do the second one.  The technology to model and animate is quickly become more realistic by the movie.

 

When I watch movies, I try to put all that I want/wish to have happen aside, and just take the movie for what it is.  What I want can come later.  This is how I enjoy The Last Jedi, but upon my review of that movie, there were just so many nitpicks it degraded what I thought of the movie.

That's a discussion for another time.  XD

From me watching the 3rd movie, it felt like a big, long epilogue of the 2nd movie.  The director even said, he wanted to set up Hiccup for the statement, "There were dragons when I was a boy."

Also, keep in mind, the way he directed the Franchise is how he viewed the original Trilogy of Star Wars.  Httyd 1 was A New Hope.  Httyd 2, was Empire Strikes Back, which the director said he wanted someone to hidelike Han Solo did.  I think Stoick's death was more like Obi-Wan's death from A New Hope.  Because I was fully anticipating Stoick not actually dying, showing up back on Berk and then defeating Drago.  Then maybe actually dying from his wounds, but to also show Toothless, it wasn't his fault.  Then Httyd 3 was Return of the Jedi.  With that in mind, Luke wanted to get rid of the Sith and turn his father, but do it as a Jedi like his father before him.  For a time after Return of the Jedi, Luke let there only be him as a Jedi before he started to train other Jedi.  With the comparision to Httyd 3, Hiccup letting the dragons go might be where the Director was saying Luke didn't want to train Jedi.  But going further than that, I believe the ending of Httyd 3 as it stands, sets up a Httyd 4 quite nicely.  More on that later.

 

I am also a storyteller.  I am one to the point I've made my own fan-fiction series, "The Jarl Mollerson Mystery Series," now into the 10th book of the series.  I've been writing them since Janurary 2013.  My series is about my own characters set in the Httyd world.  Hiccup and the gang are there, but are secondary to background characters.  My series goes into the question, "What happened off screen from the movies and TV shows?"

 

The first thing I will say about the Light Fury, is that isn't their official title...  But a name given to her by Astrid.  We saw something like this when Viggo had another name for the Dragon Eye, but like the Dragon Eye much better when Hiccup called it.  Since we don't know the origins of the Light Fury, who's to say it isn't a female Night Fury?  With my knowledge of identifying bugs and insects for ten years in 4-H, collecting over 100 insects, the color scheme of male to females are quite different.  Sometimes so different that they have completely different colors.  A male Praying Mantis can be mostly brown or tan with some green, while a female Praying Mantis will be mostly green with very little brown.  My favorite insect is the Swallowtail Butterflies.  There are several varieties of these butterflies, but the most distingishing thing about them is the difference between male and female.  However, this difference is not noticable without a trained eye, yet with a trained eye, it stands out like a sore thumb.  Males usually have a dull markings or very little color, while the females have vibrant markings.

Grimmel himself and others may not know the origins of the Light Furies.   Because they say, "A female Light Fury" can give the indication there is a "male Light Fury" but the fact remains, "What are Light Furies actually called from their origin?"  Most of the dragons we know were named by vikings.  Night Furies began in the Mystery Class because so little was known about them.  When more information became available, Night Furies went to the Strike Class.  The same can be said for the Light Furies.  As a viewer, so little is known about them.  And the question of, "How much do the other warlords let alone Grimmel actually know about the Light Furies?"  Sure, Light Furies are Grimmels favorite bait, but that may be because of their affect on male Night Furies.  If female Light Furies are so rare, who's to say they don't also have a similar hypnotising ability like the Changewings?  If the Light Fury's way is to find the first male and then somewhat hypnotize them to not act right until they mate, then maybe Toothless reacting the way he did was more of a reaction than a choice?  Because Toothless is about the same age as Hiccup, Toothless has been alone for this entire time.  If he is the last male of his kind, then he has been extremely lonely for so long.  Could it be that the reason Toothless acts so not himself is because the Light Fury really is the female version of the Night Furies?  The males being black and dull while the females are white and vibrantly sparklely?  Toothless thinking he would never see a female again and yearning for what Hiccup has with Astrid, the first chance he got to see a female, he would act totally not himself.  Being lonely can do something to people.  I mean, it changed Dagur from a lunitic to a melo good guy.

 

This also goes into the fact I've written 9 complete mysteries.  I love digging into mysteries, seeing the patterns and seeing connections to dots.  Could it very well be that the clue for the origin of why Toothless is the only Night Fury, is because Grimmel also knew about the Hidden World (maybe for a cold connection, his Father told Grimmel about the Hidden World, much like Stoick told Hiccup) and so knew that the last remaining Night Fury would one day lead him to the Hidden World, especially if he knew Night Furies had the Alpha ability.

 

Side note:  Toothless only knew he had the Alpha Ability after Valka showed him.  Maybe all Night Furies can only be an Alpha if they unlock the dual fins down their back.  And furthermore, maybe not all Night Furies had the dual fins, so maybe Toothless is like the Screaming Death.  Only one in so many hatchlings has the Alpha ability for Night Furies.  I think it would too much assumption to think all Night Furies have this ability when there are Titans in the universe that are different than their normal species.  Because we have no other Night Fury to base either side of the argument on, at this point, we both may be right.

 

The only character I think they b.utchered was Ruffnut.  She was the smarter one of the twins and came up with the better plans that helped serve the gang quite will in RTTE.  To have her at the end of the movie give up the information of New Berk and then after such a distance be followed, that was not like her character.  In that way, the ending of the movie felt forced.  Had she not dropped information about New Berk or made sure that she was not followed, if Grimmel is such an expert at tracking, he could have just confescated something of Ruffnut's then used a Tracker Class dragon to track Ruffnut back to New Berk and the current ending of the movie would feel a lot better.

 

I think the reason why so many think they b.utchered the characters is because of their lack of screen time all together.  It is almost as if this movie should about been a half hour to an hour longer to include so many characters in the story to get the benefit of more screen time they deserved.

 

The way in which they have handled Hiccstrid over the course of the franchise is a prime example of what a great relationship is supposed to be.  The ups and downs, but through it all, the grew closer together and always helped each other when the other needed it.  They were there to rebuke when needed, but they were always there to encourage.  This is why I have no problem with Valka telling Astrid to go to Hiccup.  While Astrid is the smart, warrior woman, she is shy in giving out advice to her friends when she cannot fix the problem herself.  Valka is teaching her that Astrid needs to step up and be the wife she wants to be to Hiccup, not just a close friend.  Valka could have talked more to Hiccup, but that's the point, Hiccup is growing into the adult he chooses to be.  She is there to advise and give her experience and wisdom, but somethings we have to learn on our own if we ever hope to be the man or woman we want to be.

 

The directors may have not thought they needed to give all the characters the screen time they needed because most of them had a lot in RTTE or Httyd 2.  They focused on Hiccstrid and Toothless to suplant the epilogue importance.  But because they did, the plot became quite linear and thin.  Good plot points, but the driving characters behind the plot you can count on one hand.  A good plot has multiple characters, or good supporting characters which drive the plot to its conclusion.  Managing several characters is something I have had to do over the course of my fan-fiction series.  At this point, I am managing 40+ characters, with about 10 being the core characters.  It is hard, but it is doable.  Because of this, I feel that instead of thinking a movie has 3 acts, but think of it having 3 episodes of a mini story arc within a series can better help the movie as a whole.  In RTTE, there were story arcs which lasted a few episodes.  Watching them back to back, is essentially watching a movie.  But in RTTE, they did better job of distrubiting the screen time for each character while still keeping Hiccup and Toothless as the star.  Httyd 3 forgot what brought to a third movie in the first place:  The rest of the gang from the original Flight Club before there was even a Flight Club.

What would have been cool (though would have added to the fan service) is to bring in the Berserkers, Wingmadiens, Defenders, and Outcasts for an all out battle against Grimmel, not just for the dragons' freedom, but for the freedom of the archipelago.  Because once the dragons are gone, who will march in and take over the archpelago with all the tribes split off from each other?  More on this later.

 

What Snotlout did I saw more of just wanting to get in good with whoever is in charge.  He's done this with Hiccup, trying to be friends with Astrid.  Dagur, with trying to be friends with Heather.  Because of his stature, he feels he has to act bigger than he physically is.  He feels no one will give him credit for anything, but that is his own fault for how he is.  So, he tries to play up to whoever is in charge so that he feels he is important and useful.  The very idea Snotlout came up with, Valka gave to Eret to use.  Valka is listening to Snotlout, she just doesn't want him to get a bigger ego than he already has.  Hiccup said it himself a few times during the TV shows that Snotlout was going to be the next one in line to lead the Dragon Riders, but Snotlout had to learn how to lead as a team, not as a lone wolf, while still listening to advice and heeding it.  Though Eret has more experience, Hiccup would no doubt choose Snotlout over Eret because he trusts Snotlout more than Eret.  When push comes to shove, Hiccup has trusted Snotlout more times and given him more responsibilities than Eret.  For one, Snotlout is a Berkian and Eret isn't.  But if you let Snotlout know this, he will do more harm than good.  Snotlout thinking he has to prove himself is a better viking at figuring things out than he is leaning on his ego of being the next leader.  Snotlout learned this over the course of RTTE.  But in true Snotlout fashion, he needs to be reminded of this time and time again.

 

The Twins are the twins.  You never know the next thing they will be into.  Their unpredictablity is what makes them great.  The Twins, I have no problems with in Httyd 3.  All except for Ruffnut at the end of the movie, but that was just used to drive the final plot.  Tuffnut sees himself as the close friend and advisor to Hiccup.  If you go back through Riders and Defenders of Berk, and then into RTTE, Tuffnut time and time again found out more information about Dagur and then the Dragon Hunters than anyone else did.  Because of Tuffnut playing the dumb guy, the stupid idiot, people ignore him.  Tuffnut knows this and uses it to his advantage.  Of all the things he did, he infiltrated project Shellfire when Hiccup in all his knowledge and abilities couldn't.  Hiccup values Tuffnut's advice, but Tuffnut has his own way of doing things.  The Twins unpredictablity is why I love them as characters.  They are the comic relief, they are the most objective when others have biases, they will flat out tell you the truth if you want to hear it regardless of it being blunt, but then they will also somewhat spit out nonsense that most don't understand.  You have to embrace the Twinsanity to understand them.  Tuffnut was trying to help him in the 3rd movie.  No one else was really stepping up to do it.  Everyone sees Hiccup as the chief and not being able to listen to anything because he is the chief and what he says goes.  Tuffnut doesn't see it that way.  He sees a skinny, one legged viking who needs advice.  Tuffnut gives it too him... In his own way.

Same goes for Ruffnut.  Ruffnut did similar things to help the Dragon Riders throughout the TV shows.  The Twins did more than Snotlout or Fishlegs did.  And when it comes right down to it, the Twins are the most reliable because they don't hold back.  You want them to blow something up, they won't hold back.  You want them to defend a place, they won't hold back and will defend it to the last chicken.  They are the most reliable because they are the most consistent.  They may be hard to handle day to day, but when it gets serious during the TV Shows and the first 2 movies, they are the first ones to volunteer for anything.  Tuffnut was the one who rallied the people of Berk behind Hiccup, being the first to stand up.  The Twins are the spark that gets everything going, for better or worse.  But in the end, it always works out for the betterment of the group.

 

Fishlegs is Fishlegs.  Quiet and gentle, but fierce and steadfast.  He will protect Dragons as if he was their sole protector.  Don't forget, he has the knowledge of his heritage of being Dragon Hunters to drive him to be the exact opposite.  He will do everything in his power to protect the dragons and his friends so that he will never be like his past.  Fishlegs doesn't feel like he should lead, but will be the second in command at a moment's notice.  He is the Gobber to Hiccup.  The trustworthy right hand man.  Gobber and Fishlegs may not be leadership material to lead on their own, but they are the best advisors to the leader to give any information and suggests to the current situation.  Fishlegs can do this with both vikings and dragons, being able to decipher what any dragon they are going up against.  Fishlegs will do anything to protect his friends.  He was the one who dawned the Night Fury disguise when he would know full well what Grimmel would do to the Night Fury.  Fishlegs took on that risk for the benefit of Hiccup and Toothless.

 

Valka, Eret, Gobber, Spitelout, and others just did not have enough screen time to think much of them.  But Eret's interaction with saying, "It's all a game to him," brought out the best easter egg of the entire film when Hiccup said, "Well, we've dealt with his kind before."  Directly refenceing Viggo Grimborn and his fasination with Maces and Talons

Gobber was Gobber.  Being there when needed, but telling those around him what needs to be done.  If not, he might do it for them.  He drives those to do what they need to do, when they are stalling.  Really, Hiccup and Astrid could have gotten married at the end of Httyd 2.  Gobber probably felt the same and knew that without Stoick, the Berkian people needed to see that Hiccup has the future of Berk in mind, not just dragons.

Eret is the outsider to the group.  He uses his experience as a Dragon Trapper/Hunter to good use againt any enemies of Berk.  He probably won't ever be the second in command to the Chief, but he could very well be the captain in charge of Berk's defenses.  Since he knows every previous tactic that Dragon Trappers would use, he would know how to prepare for them.

All these characters just need more screen time to be more remembered in this movie.  They were already memorable of what they did in previous movies and/or TV shows.

 

Grimmel is basically answer the question, "What if Hiccup really did kill Toothless they day he found him in the woods?"  Because Grimmel did kill a Night Fury when he found them in the woods.  And when he went back to his people, he was held in honor of a hero.  Because of this, he wanted more of this and so hunted down ever Night Fury so that other tribes would not have to worry about the evil he saw in dragons.  Because his point was, no matter how much training you can give to a dragon, they will always lean on their natural instincts to breed or defend other dragons.  This is his way of saying, "Since I know Night Furies act a certain way around female Light Furies (As said about, I think they are just female Night Furies), Hiccup's dragon will leave him.  I can get in Hiccup's head and try to devalue what he thinks of his training and his dragon by manipulating Hiccup to think his dragon no longer cares for him."

Toothless did get side tracked with the Light Fury and the Hidden World, but when push came to shove, he protected Hiccup over staying in the Hidden World.  Hiccup did train Toothless well.  His impact on Toothless as a friend rubbed off on the Light Fury in the end when his example of giving his life for his dragon, Toothless, gave the Light Fury the opportunity to save Toothless.  But, Hiccup's stubborness also rubbed off because the Light Fury saved both of them.

Grimmel I thought was a better villian than Drago.  Drago just wanted to take over the world and use dragons to do it.  Grimmel doesn't want to take over the world, he just wants everyone to come down to his level and know his truth, not what the truth of the matter really is.  Grimmel does excatly what Hiccup would do if Hiccup had an evil twin.  The greatest enemy is often yourself.  (I mean how many times have you talked yourself out of the right answer on an exam or test just because the pattern before had 3 C's.  "There can't possibly be 4 C's in a row.")  The greatest foe Hiccup could ever face would be himself.  That is Grimmel.  This is more threatening than Drago, because once he got what he wanted, he would be content.  Grimmel is never content and always wants more.  This is the most danger from another viking that Hiccup has ever faced.  Because Grimmel doesn't have to use dragons if he can't.  He doesn't have to lean on dragons as did Drago.  Grimmel can simply just take whatever anyone gives him.  Once Grimmel gets a little, he will take it all.  Those who do it for the game of it, are never satisfied.  They keep coming back for more, especially to prove they are better than the last time they played the game.

 

I have no problem either way with Toothless killing the D.eathgrippers or not.  If he didn't kill them, then he holds true to the fact that he shoots to injure.  But I think it has better character development that Toothless when the enemy gives him no other option, he will kill to protect his friends as well as his dragons.  I mean, Hiccup and Toothless killed the Red Death in the first movie.  So the precendent is already set since the first film that Hiccup and Toothless are not afraid of killing if that is their only option between their friends and family's life.  They will try their best to make it out, but if it is a call between themselves living and their friends and family living, that is an easy choice everytime.  Hiccup was prepared to "go down with the ship" with Grimmel free falling, just to save his dragon and his family.  For with Grimmel out of the way and the Warlords captured, the Dragon Trappers would have no leader and no plan and could easily be defeated by a unified Berkian people.

The kind of lesson, "When to kill?" is an important lesson I think we all need to learn.  If it is the difference between life and death for someone you love, someone you care for, someone who is just innocent in the matter, or someone who has no bearing on the situation, you should protect them as Hiccup did when the Red Death was not giving up and wanted to kill his people.  Grimmel would not give up and would keep coming back for more to defeat and/or take away all that Hiccup held dear.  When evil gives you no other choice, you have to defeat evil, regardless of who or what it is.  Hiccup did all he could against Drago, but in the end, it cost his father's life.  Some might say that had Hiccup just killed Drago off right then as he flew to meet Drago, Stoick would still be alive.  But that's the point.  How we go about doing something, is did we do it the right way.  There is a right way and wrong way to do everything.  Hiccup did everything right, but when evil doesn't care, good people get hurt.  In Httyd 2's case, Stoick died for Hiccup's opportunity to try and change Drago's mind.  Hiccup did all he could to defeat Grimmel, but when Grimmel would not stop, he took it upon himself to kill Grimmel and himself to make sure no one like him would ever hurt his family or dragons.  Because from a height in the air as their were, the impact with the ocean below would kill them.  If not, they wouldn't be able to tread water due to injuries and therefore drown.  Hiccup is responsible for Grimmel's death because Grimmel was holding on to Hiccup who was holding on to the Light Fury.  When Hiccup let go of the Light Fury, Grimmel fought Hiccup on the way down.  Hiccup pushed Grimmel away so that Hiccup could fall in peace knowing he saved his friends, his dragons, his family, and all their futures.

 

Being in Hiccup's boot, what would you do when faced with a guy so evil, he does not care and will keep coming back at you and all you love and try to take and kill anything and everything you love?  If you could stop it, would you?  If you can stop it, are you wiling to go the distance as Hiccup did with the Red Death?

These are questions Hiccup had to face in the last part of Httyd 3.  This type of serious character development helped everyone in the last part.  Because if Hiccup and the gang did nothing, all of their dragons would die.  They only option they had was put their lives on the line and fight back. 

As Mrs. Incredible told Dash and Violet in The Incredibles, "You know the bad guys you would watch on those Saturday morning cartoon shows?  These guys, are not like those guys.  They will kill you if they get the chance.  Do not give them that chance."  Grimmel, the Warlords, and their army would kill to get whatever they wanted.  Because Hiccup would fight against that, he could not give them that chance to ever do that again.  So, he took Grimmel out so that he would never do it again to anyone else.  When fighting evil and evil not giving you any other option, are you willing to put everything on the line and do all it takes to protect those you are fighting for?  Hiccup did it with the Red Death, but Hiccup grew over the course of 2 movies and 2 TV show series to answer the question, "Yes.  I will do whatever it takes, but I will do it the right way."

 

As I said before, because Toothless does have the Titan ability and even the Alpha ability, that doesn't mean all Night Furies have them.  There are other Titans of other species, most notablly the one Monstrous Nightmare and the Dramillion.  Titans are rare and only happen so often.  Alphas are even rarer.  The Red Death, Toothless, and the Bewilderbeast are the only notable ones.  However, Toothless is the only one who does not have an ability to manipulate and hypnotize dragons into being on his side.  Toothless is the only dragon to be an Alpha based on example, not by skill.  Skill plays a part, but the dragons choose to follow Toothlless, they didn't have to.  Much how the Berkians chose to follow Hiccup, they didn't have to.

 

As much as Night Furies may be OP, then how did a skinny, one legged viking, with probably the worst viking a tribe had ever seen kind of success, manage to shoot down the most OP dragon there ever was?  This being the case, Night Furies have a weak spot for thinking they are OP.  In this, anyone could have the opportunity to take a Night Fury by surprise.  No one ever tried it because they didn't think they could do it because the dragon was so OP.  The more OP the target, the bigger the weakness.  (At least in video games, this is typical logic.  The whole "The bigger they are the harder they fall" kind of thing.)
Each dragon has a weak spot.  Because Night Furies rely on flight so much, taking out its tail or wins is the best thing to do.  As Gobber said, "If it can't fly away, it can't get away."  For as much power as a Night Fury or Light Fury has, if you downed it and took away its ability to fly, it will soon be like how Toothless was in the first film.  Trapped and given up.  Both the Night Fury and Light Fury prove these points.   Grimmel trapped the Light Fury and captured it.  Then because of putting the Light Fury in the cage, it felt helpless.  A powerful dragon that feels helpless would probably be the easiest to catch because they wouldn't know what to do because most would think they are uncatchable.  Toothless gave up when he was trapped by the bola launcher.  The Light Fury gave up when she was trapped by the Dragon Trappers.  They are both able to be taken down, it is just how you go about doing it that makes all the difference.  You can't go by the logic Stoick did for so many years as well as the Warlords to capture Toothless even the Dragon Hunters for that matter.  You have to get into their mind which Grimmel was an expert at.

 

I agree, but might opt in keeping the Light Fury, but just answer the question by saying, "This is the female varient of the Night Fury."  Instead of having to say, female Night Fury all the time, just say, "Light Fury."  Then when it comes to the Night Lights, those are just baby Night Furies.

 

We've only seen one Light Fury up close.  Based on who they mate with, their markings can change as well as their eyes.  I wouldn't think that the Light Fury we see with Toothless is how all Light Furies are.

Some of the reasons things may look "Cartoony" is because if they didn't, they wouldn't look right.  The reason why you shouldn't pause any animated movie at any point is because of the simple concepts of Animation.  Like Squash and Stretch.  Because animation has to exagerate things to make it look believeable, things will be squashed and stretched slightly out of proportion to make it look realistic in the blink of an eye.   Animators sometimes have to animate in the motion blur we see naturally on real life things.  Making things bend in an odd way, slowing it down, or have a werid face, is needed for it to be believeable at full speed.  Plus, Httyd isn't meant to be photorealistic, but have a cartoony flair to it while still looking realistic.  Such the same with The Clone Wars and Rebels from Star Wars.  Has an even more cartoony feel to it, but they do that to save on animation time.  However, if you watch the last four episodes of Season 7 of the Clone Wars, given enough time and budget, you can make even cartoony animation feel like it is photorealistic.

 

Going back to a previous point, they are a powerful dragon, yet Hiccup with his one invention took one down.  Something so powerful as Toothless, can more easliy let their guard down because they think they are better than everyone else.  This is how Hiccup was able to do it.  It took someone thinking of something new and never tried before to take something that everyone thought was invincible.

The way Toothless attacked at the beginning of Httyd 1, Stoick and Gobber thought it could have been more than one.  They assumed it was more than one.  Because they never saw it up close, what else could they assume but there being more than one.  However, if they would have just stopped to think, they only ever saw one in their life time and only one at a time.  If they are so powerful, why didn't a group of Night Furies attack at once... Because they only saw one Night Fury:  Toothless.  If Toothless is the same age as Hiccup, there was only one Night Fury for about 15 years before Httyd 1.  Since Cloudjumper was in the attack when Hiccup was a baby, maybe Cloudjumper was the leader of the attacking dragons until he saw Valka.  Could it be that Cloudjumper knew there was a baby Night Fury in the making and knew what it would grow up to be, so then Cloudjumper took any dragon that wanted to go with him and headed north.  Cloudjumper's plan could have been to escape in the chaos of the attack and use it as a distraction.  The Red Death may have just brushed off Cloudjumper's not coming back as it just dying in the attack on Berk.  This gave it the opportunity to just make the Night Fury (Toothless) the leader of attacks on villages for food.

They both used a "stick" to control a dragon.  Drago used intimidation to "train" dragons while Valka used sound (the rattles in her staff) to sooth the dragons and appear as not a threat to then train the dragons.

 

The reason why for 50 years vikings did the same thing over and over again is because they had no reason not to do the same thing over and over again.  I mean, they do have stubborness issues.  It wasn't unitl Hiccup came along to question the status quo to innovate new ideas that things started changing for the better.  When more and more people start innovating, the faster the advancements come for a people.

 

---

@MidnightSXN
I will say, that if you don't care that other people like the movie... Why are you posting about h.ating the movie?  There will be those that will come on that say they liked it.  Do you not care what they think about it?  Maybe if you listen to what they are saying, you can better understand why someone likes the movie and therefore maybe like it a bit more yourself.  Saying at the beginning of your second to last paragraph, "If ou like it, I honestly don't care." and then for the last paragraph you say, "I'd love to see what everyone els did or didn't like about this movie, or even this franchise as a whole."  You cannot have it both ways.  You are frustrated at the movie.  Okay, fine.  But to not care about what other people think yet only pay attention to those who agree with you is a dangerous thought to have in anything.  Either choose to want people's imput or choose to not want any input.  You can't have it both ways, because people will be confused if you want to know what other people think or not.

---

 

This will be more of a general plot.  I haven't figured out the underlying motivations of either side or the fine details, however, if it connects to my fan-fiction, I can add more details.

 

My ideas for a Httyd 4 would be where Hiccup's kids are about the same age as Hiccup in Httyd 1.  The reason why I say Httyd 3 sets up a Httyd 4 so well is because Hiccup is falling into the same trap Stoick fell into.

 

"If we destory the nest, the dragons will leave."
"If we let the dragons go, they will be safe."

 

Sure a loyal people will follow their chief, but then there is that one skinny, quiet kid who will question, "Why?"
Both Zephyr and Nuffink will ask the question, "Why can't we have dragons?"  When Hiccup as Stoick once did, you can't have dragons (Stoick because they are dangerous, Hiccup because they are safe) will then take it upon themselves to go find the dragons themselves.

 

Meanwhile, the Night Lights are doing the same thing to Toothless and the Light Fury (We really need to find her a name).  The Night Lights are intrigued by the Vikings when the visited in Homecoming, so they want to go back.  The Night Lights fly off to go find the Vikings.

 

The Night Lights and Zephyr and Nuffink meet each other halfway, stumbling upon each other.  They do similar stuff as Hiccup did when he first met Toothless.  Zephyr and Nuffink have read The Book of Dragons multiple times, have read all of Fishlegs notebooks and things about dragons, and have dug out of Hiccup every story he could tell about dragons.  They wind up bringing the Night Lights back to New Berk, in secret, hide them in a cave and feel they should go back and tell their father what they are doing.

 

Little does anyone know that there is a new evil trying to take over the archipelago.  (According to real world history, by the time of the end of the Viking Age, either other tribes were trying to take over or other power hungry countries or pirates were trying to rage war to take over the Vikings.  Because towards the end, missionaries were going to the Vikings and showing them a better way than just pillaging and raiding other tribes.  In a sense, Hiccup was like the missionaries, showing vikings there is another way than just war.  There is peace with dragons and other tribes.)  Maybe the new evil has some type of connection to the Warlords, but maybe is someone completely new to the scene.  (We have yet to have a true villianess.  Mala kind of started out like that, but that was just because of a misunderstanding.)  Because they want to destory all dragons, they too were in search of the Hidden World.  So, the villian(ness) stumbles upon New Berk and is suprised to see that it is a settled world.  They meet Hiccup and the people of New Berk.  Hiccup hides the fact that they are from Berk, because the villian knew of the power of Berk and knew what it meant to the archipelago.  With Berk suddenly and mysteriously disappearing, the villian is also curious.  (Or Hiccup could say that they are from Berk, but that his Alpha changed and led the dragons away.  Which is technically true, but leaves out the important details of where the Hidden World is, or that it even exsists.)

 

As Zephyr and Nuffink finally come back, they see Hiccup talking to the new villian.  Because the kids are proud of their new home, they take the villian and Hiccup on a tour of New Berk.  Little do the kids know, but the Night Lights followed them back to New Berk.  As Zephyr opens the door to say a storehouse, she sees the Night Lights chowing down on the fish.  Closing the door quickly, she becomes nervous and tries to hide the fact she just saw dragons.  The villian has enough and then goes on in.  The dragons hid and aren't in sight.  They see the mess of fish everywhere and Zephyr plays it off because she didn't want Hiccup to see the mess she hadn't cleaned up yet.  The villian isn't satisfied.

 

(I guess this is playing out a little bit like when Dagur first came to Berk in Riders of Berk.)

 

When the villian is off with Gobber showing them the armory, Astrid knows something is up and tells Hiccup to go check.  Taking his kids aside, he starts to lecture him.  But in the middle of it, they try to warn him about something coming up from behind him.  He doesn't take kindly to them changing the subject... It's Toothless.  Hiccup is upset at his kids and the Night Lights.  Toothless is upset at the Night Lights and Hiccup's kids.  Hiccup and Toothless are both upset at each other thinking it was their idea.  But when the villian is starting to come back, they all try to hide.  When Gobber, Astrid, and the villian come back, now Hiccup is trying to hide the fact the dragons are back.  Now Astrid knows something is up.

 

Villian has seen enough and then leaves.

 

Overall, Httyd 4 has the same vibe and general plot of Httyd 1.  Yes, that would be copying the one that started the franchise, but that is kind of the point.  Though Hiccup did a noble thing in letting the dragons go, the rest of the archipelago is unprotected, ripe for any new threat to come in and overthrow anyone and everyone.  Hiccup must decide whether he wants to  protect his dragons and let his old allies suffer, or use his dragons to protect his old allies.  Because after Httyd 3, what happens to the Berserkers, Defenders, Wingmaidens, and Outcasts?  What about the remnants of the Dragon Hunters and Dragon Trappers?  What about the Warlords?  If they are still alive, are they out for revenge?  There are still dragons like the Purple Death and other Red Deaths out there.  Maybe they are coming in and destroying islands and killing dragons.  Maybe this is the evil that has come in.  The viking who meets Hiccup just wants to profit on the chaos.

 

Dragons need protecting, especially of their sacred Hidden World.  But there are still more dragons out there in the world who have a lot less protection from any would be trapper/pirate looking for a quick gold strike in selling a dragon hide.  But there are vikings still out there that need the protection of dragons to fend off would be pirates, trappers, etc.  Did Hiccup think of them when he let the dragons go?

 

Someone who Hiccup always had a close relationship to finds him and questions his decision on letting the dragons go, based on what it did to the rest of the archipelago:

You always think things will always happen to other people, never yourself.  But when reality doesn’t care who you are, you’ll begin to question everything you stand for just to get your future back.  Then you will know who you have always been and will always be:  Hiccup Haddock the Third, Chief of the Hooligan Tribe – DRAGON RIDER!

---

I can give a lot more details about a Httyd 4, however, it might somewhat spoil a book later on in my fan-fiction series.  If you want to know what else I think about a Httyd 4, I can pm you them.

 

---

 

Thank you for reading this extremely long post.

 

You have just read 7992 words.

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Book 10 - The Shattered Axe

Chapter 17 - Back on Track

 

The Jarl Mollerson Mystery Series

All Chapter Links
 

 

Destiny in the Dark

Chapter 3 - Friends and Enemies

 

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Here are links to the chapters of my fan-fic series.  The books go in chronological order.

 

The Clue of the Missing Socks.

Chapters 1 and 2                         Chapter 3                                       Chapter 4

Chapter 5                                      Chapter 6                                        Chapter 7

Chapters 8 and 9                        Chapter 10                                     Chapter 11

Chapters 12 and 13                     Chapters 14, 15, and 16             Chapter 17

Chapter 18                                    Chapter 19                                      Chapter 20

Chapter 21 and 22                      Chapter 23                                     Chapter 24 and 25

Chapter 26 - There is a hidden surprise.  Can you find it?

Chapter 27                                   Chapter 28, Part 1                         Chapter 28, Part 2

Chapter 29                                   Chapter 30                                       Chapter 31

Chapter 32                                   Chapter 33                                       Chapter 34

Chapter 35                                   Chapter 36                                       Chapter 37

Chapter 38                                   Chapter 39                                       Chapter 40

Chapter 41                                   Chapter 42                                       Chapter 43

Chapter 44                                   Chapter 45, Parts 1 and 2

 

The Mysterious Frozen Fire

Chapter 1         Chapter 2         Chapter 3         Chapter 4         Chapter 5         Chapter 6

Chapter 7         Chapter 8         Chapter 9         Chapter 10       Chapter 11       Chapter 12

Chapter 13       Chapter 14       Chapter 15        Chapter 16       Chapter 17       Chapter 18  

Chapter 19       Chapter 20      Chapter 21        Chapter 22, Part 1       Chapter 22, Part 2 

Chapter 22, Part 3

Epilogue/Preview for my Third Story!

 

Thoughts of Guilt

Chapters 1 and 2          Chapters 3 and 4          Chapter 5          Chapter 6          Chapter 7

Chapter 8          Chapter 9          Chapter 10          Chapter 11          Chapter 12, Part 1

Chapter 12, Part 2          Chapter 13         Chapter 14         Chapter 15         Chapter 16

Chapter 17 and 18         Chapter 19         Chapter 20         Chapter 21         Chapter 22

Chapter 23         Chapter 24         Chapter 25         Chapter 26         Chapter 27

Chapter 28         Chapter 29         Chapter 30         Chapter 31         Chapter 32

Chapter 33         Chapter 34         Chapter 35         Chapter 36 and 37

Chapter 38, Part 1         Chapter 39, Part 2         Chapter 40, Part 3         Chapter 41

Chapter 42, Parts 1 and 2         Chapter 43         Chapter 44

Chapter 45, Part 1         Chapter 45, Part 2

 

On the Edge of Mystery

Chapter 1          Chapter 2         Chapter 3        Chapters 4 & 5    Chapter 6, Parts 1 and 2   

Chapter 7          Chapter 8         Chapter 9            Chapter 10       Chapter 11        Chapter 12

Chapter 13        Chapter 14       Chapter 15          Chapter 16        Chapter 17       Chapter 18

Chapter 19        Chapter 20       Chapter 21          Chapter 22       Chapter 23      Chapter 24

Chapter 25        Chapter 26       Chapter 27         Chapter 28        Chapter 29 Parts 1 and 2 

Chapter 30       Chapter 31       Chapter 32 and 33                         Chapter 34 Parts 1 and 2 

Chapter 35 Part 1         Chapter 35 Part 2        Chapter 35 Part 3        Chapter 36

 

The Secret Symbol

Chapter 1    Chapter 2    Chapter 3    Chapter 4    Chapter 5

Chapter 6    Chapter 7     Chapter 8    Chapter 9    Chapter 10

Chapter 11    Chapter 12    Chapter 13    Chapter 14    Chapter 15

Chapter 16    Chapter 17    Chapter 18    Chapter 19    Chapter 20

Chapter 21   Chapter 22   Chapter 23   Chapter 24 and 25

Chapter 26    Chapter 27    Chapter 28    Chapter 29 and 30

Chapter 31    Chapter 32    Chapter 33    Chapter 34    Chapter 35

Chapter 36    Chapter 37    Chapter 38    Chapter 39

Chapter 40 and 41    Chapter 42    Chapter 43, 44, 45, and 46

 

The Legend of Shadow Mountain

Chapter 1    Chapter 2    Chapter 3    Chapter 4    Chapter 5

Chapter 6    Chapter 7    Chapter 8    Chapter 9    Chapter 10

Chapter 11    Chapter 12    Chapter 13    Chapter 14    Chapter 15

Chapter 16   Chapter 17    Chapter 18    Chapter 19    Chapter 20

Chapter 21    Chapter 22    Chapter 23    Chapter 24    Chapter 25

Chapter 26    Chapter 27    Chapter 28    Chapter 29    Chapter 30

Chapter 31    Chapter 32    Chapter 33    Chapter 34    Chapter 35

Chapter 36    Chapter 37    Chapter 38    Chapter 39    Chapter 40

Chapter 41    Chapter 42    Chapter 43    Chapter 44    Chapter 45 & 46

Chapter 47    Chapter 48    Chapter 49    Chapter 50    Chapter 51

 

Teaser "Trailer" for Book 8 - Conquest of the Truth

 

The Crimson Storm

Chapters 1 and 2     Chapter 3    Chapter 4    Chapter 5    Chapter 6

Chapter 7    Chapter 8    Chapter 9    Chapters 10 and 11    Chapter 12

Chapter 13    Chapter 14    Chapter 15    Chapter 16    Chapter 17    Chapter 18

Chapter 19    Chapter 20    Chapter 21    Chapter 22    Chapter 23

Chapter 24    Chapter 25 and 26    Chapter 27    Chapter 28    Chapter 29

Chapter 30    Chapter 31    Chapter 32    Chapter 33    Chapter 34

Chapter 35 and Epilogue

MidnightSXN's picture
MidnightSXN
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.

Wow!! That must have taken such a long time to write, and I appreciate it! You made some very good points, I must say. And your idea for a fourth movie would be awesome! Maybe if you do eventually become an animator for Dreamworks, you might be able to pitch that idea.

 

By the way, I responded to another person who also had some very good explanations (the other long post lol) and explained my "If you like this movie, I honestly don't care." All I meant was that I don't care that you disagree, as in, that won't make me view you any different than if you agreed with me. Sorry for not being that clear. I was very emotional when writing my rant, lol.

 

The only thing is, since we know what the offspring of Toothless and the LF look like, I don't think the LF could be just a female NF. While I do like that idea, I don't think it's plausible since Dart (female) is mostly black and Pouncer (male) is mostly white. I think a female NF would look like the male but be smaller, maybe have slightly shorter nubs, and be a little duller. But I guess we'll never know since we haven't ever seen a female NF and we probably never will. :')

 

Your theories about Toothless being an alpha and a titan definitely have a better explanation for the OPness. But I just still don't like the idea of an alpha mode (not the spines, but the glowing part) and an invisible ability because the NF was already the fastest, smartest, and most elusive dragon. Plus, they can block arrows with their wings, go toe to toe with many large dragons (whispering death and monstrous nightmare, for instance), hold over 400 pounds on their back, carry a hideous zippleback (which weighs more than a m. nightmare), and now they can harness lightning to become completely invisible, and activate an alpha mode that allows unlimited shots for a short period of time (if we're going off the assumption that Toothless is just a regular NF and not a Titan or Alpha).

 

As for Hiccup s.hooting Toothless down . . . I mean, he is a fairly large target that you can track in the sky if you see blotted stars, and a bola can probably be launched pretty far and pretty fast (a boulder can be launched from a catpult at about 184 feet per second; just imagine how fast a spinning rope with some weight on the end of it can go!). All he really had to do was locate Toothless and lead his s.hot.

 

On a side note, I'd love to read your fanfiction! Is that what's posted in your siggy? I also wish you the absolute best of luck with your future as an animator. Don't forget us here on the forums if you ever become successful. ;P

 

If you'd like to read more into what I'm talking about in my rant, here's an incredible article Wolf and Star shared on here: https://archiveofourown.org/works/18845653 It's also a long read, but definitely worth checking out. Whoever wrote it put into words what I couldn't and even brought up some points I hadn't even considered. Some of your ideas in your HTTYD 4 idea line up with the criticisms (the Vikings and other people around the world being affected by the dragons moving away and the other dragons that didn't go to the Hidden World).

 

Once again, thank you for taking the time to respond!

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httyyd
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Drums R Round. Pi R Squared.

You are quite welcome. :)
It took me a day and a half to respond to it all while adding in the parts I wanted to add.  In total time, probably 6 hours to write.  But I didn't write it in one sitting.  Probably about 5 sittings.

That's the plan.  I even hope to pitch my fan-fiction series for a potential open world video game.  As if Mass Effect meets Horizon Zero Dawn who both are also friends with Assassin's Creed.  To have a Triple A, open world, adventure/mystery video game set in the world of Httyd, I'd preorder that thing right now.  Wtih all of SoD's problems, the game is still alive 7 years later.  There is a demand for a Httyd open world video game.  To have it the likes and size of a Horizon Zero Dawn where you can visit every island in the franchise, including island and characters from SoD, that would be a dream come true.   A game where you wouldn't go back through the story as Hiccup, but you would go back through the franchise as your own viking, witnessing the events of all 3 movies, all shorts, and all TV shows.  It would be a lot to take on for a game, but the way video games are going now, it is compeltely doable.

 

I read most your interaction with them, and figured that's what you meant.  Maybe since two people pointed it out (while I wrote my reply, I didn't refresh the page and didn't see any new posts past what 3/4's of the first page was) reviewing while you write could be something to work on.  So in case something might come across differently, you can word it in the way you meant.

 

My family recently had a cat who had kittens.  Based on the colorings of the mama and the daddy, the kittens were a mixture of the mama and the daddy.  The mama cat is somewhat like a calico but with grays, whites, and some sandy orange colorings.  The daddy is a orange taby cat with tiger markings.  The first kitten, ironically is mainly dark gray with the color areas of a dark gray sides, back, and heads, with a white belly and chin.  He also has black tiger markings.  He is a medium length haired kitten, not long and not short.  The second kitten is a boy, nearly the same markings, but orange, white, with darker orange tiger markings.  Slightly shorter haired cat.  The third kitten is a girl and barely has any color on her.  She is practically all white except for a few splotches of orange here and there.  We joke that the mother ran out of ink making her, she used all the blacks and grays on the first, had to change the cartirdges for the second, but then ran out of orange, so had to settle with mostly all white.

My point is, when two animals mate, the one is all one color and the other is all another color, it has happened many times that the offspring has multiple colors as well as very unique markings that neither the mama or the daddy had.  For the Night Lights to have the markings they do with their mother and father are all white or all black, is quite possible.  For one thing, under a dragon's scales, their skin could have markings too.

Like my dog has checkered pink and black skin.  Also, with gray cats, they are technically called blue colored cats.  Because, their skin is a shade of really dark blue, most of the time.

How exactly markings work is still like flipping a coin to say it will be anything, but I've seen it happen with two mates who have specific colors and markings, or just one color and no markings, have babies who look nothing like them.

 

With the Alpha mode, I don't much like it either, but if I think in my own head cannon that not all Night Furies had it, but they had to earn the ability to unlock their spines, it makes the Alpha mode in Night Furies much rarer.  As much as the Alpha mode looks like they have unlimted shots, from my own research, they don't.  I think Alpha mode adds between 4-5 shots to Toothless, but that's it for firing.  It adds to their turning rate, speed, and such, but Alpha mode on this side only lasts for so long before the Night Fury has to revert back and conserve energy.  It is like a power-up on cool down.  Powerful, but can only use it for so long and so many times in the same span of time.  If Toothless is a Titan, then he has the amount of stamina needed to do all of these abilities and still be able to function normally after the fact.  But if you go back through the franchise and look at how he sleeps, he sleeps every chance he gets.  To preform all he does, he needs all the sleep he can get to have the stamina to begin with.

 

Toothless is a fairly large target, but the way Hiccup was acting, he had never actually fired his bola launcher.  For if he had, he would have realized the recoil on the shot and had already fixed it for another go.  Because the bola launcher flung him off, he had never fired it before.  This adds to the fact that his meeting with Toothless was truly a once in a lifetime event.  Everything happend at the right time and they were in the right moment.  Maybe coincindental in some views, but that's the classic hero origin story.  Everything happening at the right moment at the right time for their to be a new story than what the hero thought he wanted.

Yet to lead his shot, in the middle of the night with a dragon who is black, watching the movie, I could barely see the black shadow of Toothless when he flew over the stars.  Because there was enough light for us to see it as a viewer, that's all due to post processing.  Because there was no light polutition from say a nearby campfire or building on fire XD, it would realistically if you were a witness to it, would be a lot darker than us just watching the movie.  Kind of like when Han said, "That was one in a million, kid." Rememberized the line (My sister and I came up with the term rememberize when you remember something from memory, but are paraphrasing it, yet it sounds like it is word for word the quote, you therefore, rememberized it.), Hiccup's shot to knock down Toothless was that one in a million shot.  Hiccup knew all the physics and calculations needed to lead his shot... On paper.  But because of the recoiling of the shot surprising him, he never tested it so only relied on his calculcations.  Had he practiced with it... Come to think of it Toothless may have been injured more than just losing a tail fin.  Because Hiccup didn't practice it even with leading the shot, the recoil of a launcher such as that can mess up the thing you aimed at.  It would be interesting if without so much recoil, Hiccup would have actually missed.  But with the recoil, he grazed Toothless.  With it being a bola launcher, a graze hit is almost better because it will less likely kill the intended target.

 

That is what is in my siggy.

My first book being: The Clue of the Missing Sock.
"Why socks?" you might ask.  Glad you asked... Go read my book to find out.  :D  XD

 

If you see on the new topic lists "The Shattered Axe," that is Book 10 of my series.  My series is in chronological order and does reference the franchise, while being its own original mystery series with my own characters.  People how have read the book have submitted the OC vikings to be in the book.  I have yet to say no to a submission.  If you want to add a character, feel free to pm it to me.  I have a suggested idea form to fill out for what to think about when making a character if you want to look at it or use it for another story.

Other books in my series include:
The Mysterious Frozen Fire

Thoughts of Guilt

On the Edge of Mystery

The Secret Symbol

Mystery of Shadow Mountain

The Crimson Storm

Conquest for the Truth

The Mist in the Darkness

 

And currently writing:
The Shattered Axe

 

If you ever need the link to a chapter, I can hook you up.  Otherwise, it is cool to google, "The Clue of the Missing Socks Chapter 1 httyyd" with two y's btw, and watch my story come up in a google search.  Sure, it is a very specific search query, but hey, Google found it.

 

I did see Wolf and Star's post.  I'll check the article out later.  Thank you for also putting it here.

 

Over all, Httyd 3 is a great movie.  However, the more someone has to read into the movie to make it great, tells me the movie on its own might not be as great as it is.  I'm saying this to myself.  We all love Httyd 1 for what it is.  Anyone who simply just watches the movie should love it.  Anyone who watches Httyd 3, needs to have an open mind and watch it for what it is, not what they think it should be.  But watching a movie when someone says there are stipulations, tells me it isn't that great a movie.  Don't get me wrong, movies like this are still good movies, they just don't live up to other movies, especially if they are in a series, franchise, or trilogy.  I think this is what all of us are running into when looking at Httyd 3.
Overall for what the story played out to be, a perfect ending to the franchise.  However, looking at the entirity of the franchise as a whole, Httyd 3 falls a bit short of the potential of an extremely well done ending to basically DreamWorks's Star Wars of their company.  Httyd has made the most money for DreamWorks than any other franchise, it has surpassed some of their live actions movies too.

 

No problem.  Talking about Httyd is always fun, especially when I get to talk about lore and the meaning behind it.  Then it gets extremely fun when I get to talk about the extended lore of "Why did this happen?" with regards to answering those questions in my book series.

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Lol that's funny

6 hours?? Good grief. Well, I seriously appreciate the effort. That's dedication. And a video game like that would be AMAZINGPlease hurry up and pitch the idea because I need it now

 

Aw, kittens. And the running out of ink thing is hilarious. I completely understand what you're saying. I just meant because we do see other LF's in the HW and they're white too that the LF is probably its own species. And while the LF being the female variant of the NF would be pretty cool, I don't think it would make much sense since Grimmel has supposedly k.illed every NF save for Toothless. But the LF being its own species would be weird too since they look so feminine. Animals aren't supposed to look feminine, lol. 

 

Again, your explanation of the Alpha mode makes a lot more sense. Toothless being an Alpha and Titan would definitely be better explained the way you're putting it. Wow, you've put a lot of thought into this!

 

That makes sense too. You know, a few days ago I saw a picture of the scene in the first movie of when Hiccup is putting Toothless' prosthetic tail fin on for the first time and you can actually see the leftover skin where his fin was ripped off. Do you think that his tail was probably hit first, and after the fin ripped off, the bola then wrapped around his body? That could be why Toothless didn't d.ie when he was hit.

 

Nice! I'll have to check it out.

 

I probably won't submit a character because didn't you mention juggling 40+ characters? I don't want to add on to that, lol. That's insane.

 

No problem! It's very interesting and I definitely recommend it.

 

Personally, I wouldn't call it a great movie. It had great potential, yes, but the execution wasn't as well as it could've been. I still think they shouldn't have gone with the book ending, since the movies thus far have been treated as their own separate entity. But since they did go with it, I just wish it was handled better. I actually rewatched the movie earlier so it was fresh on my mind, and I wrote in a notebook what I thought was wrong with it. I might post those either on this thread or another post depending on how active this one remains. I just wanted to spark discussion about this because it didn't seem like many people were talking about it.

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Never fear, for Blobby's here!

I just wanted to add something...  I think that the Light Fury is indeed a female Night Fury, and maybe Grimmel just wanted to wipe out all of the males because then the species would go extinct.  With the Night-Lights being mismatched colors, maybe they shed their skin later?  There are many examples of reptiles molting or mammals changing color and patters when they grow up.

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Maybe so, but I just went back and saw the clip of Grimmel telling Hiccup "I am the night fury k.iller. I have hunted every last one but yours." So I doubt that LF's are female NF's. Here's the link: https://youtu.be/qKLP5zNlli8 He says it at 1:48.

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That's very true.  I am just hoping otherwise for my peace of mind, and also for storytelling purposes.

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I don't blame you, lol.

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Reeee

Httyd 2:

The fact that Drago says to Hiccup "You sure are hard to get rid of" right after having every opportunity to do so back on Valka's sanctuary when he had taken control of all the dragons. Like you let this guy live and now your complaining that he is back ready to beat your a.ss.  What the he.ll DreamWorks. They literally just dumbed down Drago so that Hiccup the hero would have a chance at beating him. And if Drago had any sense, he would have also killed Hiccup when Toothless started showing signs that he was breaking free from the alpha bewilderbeast's control. At that first head shake that Toothless made after Hiccup told him it wasn't his fault for killing Stoick, Drago should have known that Hiccup was starting to win him over. But nope. He waited until Toothless had fully broken free of the bewildrbeast's control to take any action. Ugh

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Since this is a kids forum,

Since this is a kids forum, you are best to refrain from using curse words, even if you put a . in the middle of them.

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Are they tho

Those are curse words..?

Huh...

 

Well I can't edit it since you directly replied 

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Never fear, for Blobby's here!

Yeah, they are...

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Tomorrow... and possibly later today!

Just out of curiousity, how are they curse words? 

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They are both commonly known as curse words.  So, you should avoid saying them on the forums.

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Tomorrow... and possibly later today!

I still don't get it, but I will avoid saying them. 

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Thanks

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Drums R Round. Pi R Squared.

The way in which they were used is what changes them to be curse words.  Both have original meanings that world doesn't commonly (or even know what their original use was) to use them for that any more.

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Tomorrow... and possibly later today!

I see. 

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Much better explained than mine.

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Toothless in HTTYD 1 vs in HTTYD 3

Here's what I mean by Toothless looks cartoony in the third. Look at him in the first movie compared to the third.

 

 

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The lighting differences are due to post processing advancements in the technology.  This type of processing power is what made them be able to pull off going inside the Hidden World.  Httyd 3 had a lot more color and was more vibrant than Httyd 1 with it being dull with all lot of browns and greens.
I think what adds to him being different in Httyd 3 than 1 is he shows a ton more emotion in the 3rd, more human emotion than just a cat reacting to something being attached to his tail in 1.  1's emotion was cartoony, but animal like.  Whereas 3's emotion was also cartoony but seemed more human like.  Maybe this is what a dragon will end up doing when he is around humans for that amount of time.

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Makes sense. Thanks for explaining! But to be honest, I kind of prefer his look in the first movie.

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No problem.  You are quite welcome.  I think that is the thing with any trilogy.  Every movie or TV show after that has to live up to the first one.  Most times the first one is the best of any trilogy or franchise.

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who is the alpha in the hidden world?

Is is the light fury?

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Dragons:

Thunder (shockjaw)

Sharpshooter (Titan D.  Nadder)

Slushball (Groncicle)

Drill (W.death)

Steelheart (Armor Wing)

Zig and Zag (H. zippleback)

Buzz (groncle)

lavaeater (Eruptidon)

Obsidian (Eruptodon)

Inferno (m. nightmare)

Fireball (singetail)

Stormfather (Titan skrill)

Shard (razorwhip)

Apollo (death song)

Chamomile (prickleboggle)

Nightshade (Flame whipper)

Frostfang (shivertooth)

Stormhunter (wolly howl)

Skyfyre (stormcutter)

Zariel (typhoomerang)

Booomer (thunderdrum)

Frill (hobblegrunt)

Scorpion (speed stinger)

Daenerys (fireworm queen)

Thorn (grim gnasher)

Mufasa (chimeragon)

Dart (night light)

Copperhead (changwing)

AuroraSeeker (tidal glider)

Opal (Deathgripper)

Earthshaker (c goargutter)

Pine (timberjack)

Shieldmaker (bonestormer)

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It may have not had an Alpha.  Though if it was the Light Fury, it would only been the queen, a queen looking for a king.

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You just read my mind

God-so that title first off sounds probably weird and sorry, but you completely summed up all my problems with HTTYD 3. Toothless looks... like a plastic toy, almost, with weirdly defined eyebrows. The animation itself is... decent, but it doesn't have the same weight as the first two movies do, if that makes sense. It's got impact, but the first two (in my experience anyway) have a weight to the animation that makes it just resonate a little more with those who watch it that 3 just... lacks.

 

Making the mystery of Night Furies actually make sense would be much better, instead of the casual way that the light fury was tossed into the story. I don't dislike them, they kinda remind me of beluga whales which I find to be kinda funny as a concept(and am going to eternally pretend they are more aquatic than they're shown to be in the movie).

 

An albino night fury with blue eyes was quite common-or a regular night fury. In my mind that makes sense at least, due to how Hiccup's and Toothless' eyes match, which was part of their story arc and what have you. (Granted it wasn't touched on a lot, but Hiccup towards the end of the first movie, when he says "I wouldn't k.ill him because he looked as frightened as I was. I looked at him, and I saw myself." kinda shows this, in a way.) due to Astrid's eyes being blue and the... well. The super obvious romance thing that everybody wrote her and Hiccup into.

 

Grimmel would be an interesting villain if done right, but he's... really, really not written well in the third movie. (Then again, nobody is, as you said.) There are so many inconsistencies-the movie took one of the most notable qualities of Berkians and just... threw it aside? Like, sure, those dragons were a danger, but they were being controlled, and one would hope that they'd expand upon them when they're not being treated as mindless puppets.

 

In the movies it seems like Night Furies are nigh unstoppable, while in the shows it at least is somewhat revealing that they do have weaknesses (largely, extremely cold weather from what I remember) barring the obvious of the tail fin being integral to flight.

 

Drago was... weird. "King of all dragons" could be controlled with a stick? Something that can be broken and just... easily replaced? Yeah sure that makes sense. I get they needed a villain but possibly they should've had a bit more thought put towards making a villain... actually threatening.

Your replacement idea, even if it isn't all put together perfectly and is incomplete, it has more of a structure than the official movie to be honest. And it even makes sense!

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Hey, I'm 19, call me Redd-or whatever you want to really. Life's movin' on and I have no idea what's going on 100% of the time. Dragons are good, though, so life ain't all bad. (Nearly Fishlegs 2.0, to some people, as I can be given the vaguest description of a dragon and narrow it down to what one it is fairly quickly, and explain their abilities for the most part.)

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Shiny the Night Fury plasma blasted my subject. Sorry!

Funny that you say that, because for the longest time I couldn't find a way to describe Toothless' look in HTTYD 3, but calling him a plastic toy is definitely the most accurate. Not only that, but he has no details on his body anymore. Look at this pic from HTTYD 1!

 

 

Look at how much detail is on him! Night furies are supposedly based off panthers. Well, guess what? Panthers have markings like that too! Even as adults!

 

 

 

I agree about the light furies. I hate Toothless' love interest, but the species I'm fine with. I love beluga whales, so it's cool how their head is kind of based off of them. But like you said, they should be more aquatic than they're shown in the movie. The main thing I don't like about light furies is how feminine they look.

 

Yeah, Grimmel was not written the best. I feel like the disappointment (that I have, at least) stems mostly from the villains in RTTE. No one can top Viggo. Compared to the intellectual prowess of Viggo, Grimmel seems like a little boy who only knows how to hunt one type of animal. 

 

Don't get me wrong, Drago was an underwhelming villain as well. His motivation was cliche.

 

But you know what makes me the most angry about HTTYD 3 (besides no more night furies)? How incompetent a leader Toothless is. Now, I wasn't a fan of the whole alpha junk even during HTTYD 2. I thought the dragons bowing to him was a sort of respect they had for him, but I guess they went with it. Anyway, when Grimmel captured the LF and Toothless, Toothless literally orders every single dragon on Berk into cages to d.ie all for some girl he met two days before. If I were a Berkian, I would've yelled at Hiccup for allowing his dragon to lead mine to sl.aughter just because Toothless is experiencing h.ormones for the first time in his life. UGH. It makes me despise Toothless.

 

Man, I'm getting riled up again. I never thought anyone else would comment on this thread, but I still appreciate it when someone does! I love hearing everyone's thoughts on this movie.

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Toothless

who else noticed that throughout the movies and tv shows its hiccup who cares about not hurting dragons and toothless does not care at all. (dragon fights episode) so (someone mentioned this earlier) toothless killing the deathgripers is not a plot hole. 

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Well, actually, your point is not very valid.  In the dragon fighting episode, Toothless makes sure that he doesn't hurt the dragons.  He shoots a cage on top of the razorwhip instead of killing it, and releases the Triple Stryke.  Hiccup wasn't responsible for his actions, rather, Toothless chose not to hurt them.  Sorry if this sounded rude, I just had to throw that out there.

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i just wached that episode

toothless only does not kill because hiccup shouts NO! or somthing to make him not finish them. they toothless, the smart dragon that he is figures out a nonlethal solution. 

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With the triple stryke, Hiccup doesn't say anything to prevent Toothless from killing it.  Toothless was just stung by the triple stryke, and Hiccup thought that the only way would be for Toothless to kill it, so that he could get the antidote.  However, he had Sleuther pinned pinned down, and was about to make the killing shot, when he looked into his eyes.  It was like a flashback to the first movie, and Toothless was not able to kill the dragon.  I watched this episode rather recently, and this is what I remember from it.